The best thing about Vim is that despite having all the features of a modern IDE it starts in 0.1s and you can start editing right away while the code data is loading asynchronously.
The worst thing about Vim is that… just kidding, there’s nothing bad about it.
Vscode I’m always like all right let’s code… Ah shit, the “what’s new” window has popped up again in the middle of my typing…
I never close my IDE or reboot. Problem solved.
My work Mac always bitches about it because they push updates.
Also had to update virtually every time I touched it and half the time those updates would break it so I had to reinstall. I didn’t use it on a daily basis or anything and it’s been a few years so maybe they fixed that but it’s why I don’t currently use it (along with the fact that it’s a microsoft product and I’m trying to stay away from all their shit as much as possible).
0.1s is way too long, you need to optimize your startup time. /s
There also IDEs that start instantly.
They don’t ship a whole browser though.
People meme about “q!” but it is super helpful to have that extra step, because sometimes your fingers are moving faster than your brain is. That quick switch back-n-forth vim - gcc - ./a.out loop and my probably ADHD mean that vim saying, “hey, remember you haven’t saved this yet” is a godsend.
You are right about the best part about vim - you can work as fast you type.
It’s a trade off for sure. I think the area editors like Vim totally win in is when you need to ssh into a server and edit something. I think it will always exist because of this use case
I can ssh in with Krusader and edit from Krusader’s GUI editor. I would probably still do it from the terminal because it’s faster, but it’s good to have more than one way to do things.
Is it bad that vscode is my favorite ssh client
I like VSCodium, a vscode build without ms telemetry and such
sounds interesting enough to try, thanks! :D
it’s identical to vscode, except that a few extensions don’t work (notably, intellicode and the ms c/c++ extensions)
vim was such an unimaginable improvement over nano for doing stuff on linux servers. Having an in-shell-editor search-and-replace function alone is worth everything you have to do to learn vim.
And after I was comfortable around vim because of all the “training” on servers, I just switched to vim fulltime. No more GUI editor for me!
Nanos search and replace is
Alt+Ras far as I rememberHa, that would’ve helped me a few times. Good to know!
Still, I wouldn’t switch vim for nano ever again. nano is a good and easy start, but I think if you do more than just basic editing of a few files every now and then, learning vim is the way to go.
vim is pretty customizable, widespread and it has been around for quite some time after all. If you think you need it, somebody most likely already made it as a vim-plugin :)
Emacs with evil mode
Ah! I loved using Doom EMacs for a while!
… but alas I came back to my initial love with Neovim 😜
So kind of off topic. Like 15 years ago emacs vs vim split in engineering was like 50-50. Now I see more like like 90-10 with vim winning. What happened? I always assumed they are equivalent more or less.
Emacs has scripts that can do almost anything. If you wanted to, you could pretty much replace your graphical desktop with Emacs and still do pretty much everything you do. vi is an editor.
There’s been a lot more evangelism about emacs lately.
Also the fact emacs has doom and spacemacs to ease new users in while vim drops you into
:and tells you to swim means that it’s easier for emacs to get new users.
Yeah, this is the best solution at the end of the day for most would be text wizards, emacs is beautiful, vim keybindings are beautiful.
lisp makes my brain relax
You will be tempted to think that by learning how to use (neo)VIM your coding skills will magically improve tenfold.
It won’t
Wait really? Shit I’m like 1 year into learning vim. What editor should I switch to that will magically make me a good coder?
Jokes aside, all of my favorite IDEs have an option to use VIM key bindings so learning VIM makes it easier to learn other IDEs.
That alone was enough to convince me to learn VIM
HAHAHAHA I know the secret passcode to escape!
Incidentally, it’s ctrl+]. But I remap it to ‘kj’, and somehow have never typed ‘blackjack’ in all my years of using Vim!
I fucking love that 😆
I just use cntrl-z and then
kill %1Seems like overkill to escape from insert mode. Then you just have to open vi again!
So… we meet at last, Doctor Evil!
Wouldn’t the one that ops you into telemetry be the trap?
I used to know a developer who wrote all his code in Notepad. This was around 2005 or 6. We had just starting to replace our legacy ASP code with ASP.Net, which he was determined to do in Notepad. I was gone before I could see how that worked out.
helix btw
Helix is “it just works” but it actually does, without having to get lost in the (config) sauce.
It’ll be unstoppable once they finalize and ship the plugin system.
Edit: and I haven’t even mentioned the descriptions above commands, the command palette-like functionality in
<Space-, nor the tutor yet. It’s just so much more beginner-friendly.Yeah, so many things are so easy to configure with less moving parts, plus the window splitting is amazing.
When the pluggings system drops it’s going to be wild.
Vim and VScode are my favorite code editors but I admit that Vim is better :]
Knowing how to actually navigate vim is worth learning. Especially if you work in embedded systems where a lot of the time you’re on setup that is running barebones and likely just has vi as a text editor.
But I used VSCode for dev work with the VIM plugin.
Good luck exiting that!
ctrl-x. ;)
oh no no no
it’s the x button on the top right of the window
laughs in i3
Laughs in Zed
The trap is that you should use vi. Don’t wuss out.
Too much pain there, sorry.
Yeah. A lot of people who use vim don’t know how to use the full power of vi. They’ll often install plugins to do things they could have easily done with built in features!
The one area where regular vi sucks though is undo. If you want multiple undo then you’ll have to at least go with something like nvi.
imagine thinking a non user will read this and want to use vi/vim
vim users have the same energy as latex users
I don’t really recommend people learn vi/vim even though I’ve been using it for years and love it. It’s a very personal thing and the time you invest into learning it might not be worth it if you don’t use its features enough.
I think it’s dependent on your personality and neurodivergence/neurotypical characteristics (I don’t know a word that encompasses all of this). If you’re the type of person who gets really annoyed/distracted by any sort of “friction” in the editing process then I think you may be a good candidate to learn vi. Otherwise probably not!
Edit: by the way I’m also a LaTeX user!
I sometimes wonder why some programmers don’t use vim. Aren’t they lazy enough to be bothered about unnecessary work and “friction” you have to deal with when using ordinary editors. I’d rather do the interesting parts of the job and command the computer to do the rest. Of course the communication with the computer has to be as concise, as effortless, and as easy as possible.
For me (sysadmin actually) it’s because what I’m doing is either simple enough that I can use Nano (editing simple config files) or complicated enough that I’ll want a full fledged IDE. I use VSCode and it handles remote files really really well.
Although I have learned a little bit of Vi/Vim because sometimes thats all you have.
Plus if you’re doing major changes (like more than editing a line or two) you shouldn’t be doing that on a production server anyways. Like if I found out an engineer or dev was primarily working directly off of the server they would probably be on their way out the door. Uptime is worth way too much for that nonsense.
vim user
LaTeX user
When you go to the wrong side
I prefer to call it the dark side!
Come to the evil side, we have org-mode
I’ve tried. It breaks my brain too much. I’ve even used emacs without evil but the unholy combination just does not work for me.
I have the same problem with all vi/vim emulation modes in other editors. There’s always some incongruity that messes me up.
Why not both?
When the debate revolved around Emacs vs. Vim, I used Spacemacs. It seem we moved on from that?
Is it now about VScode vs. (Neo)Vim?
Guess that means Vim won the Emacs vs. Vim debate then, when it got into the next round.
It was never really a competition - just some misguided people who liked Emacs
wait what?
It’s VIM features and key bindings that you can toggle on and off with a hotkey in VScode.
Very handy when you have a task that VIM is better at (for your workflow), like recording s macro and replaying 100 times.
Hmmm there seems to be a vscode in my vim.
This is alright if you only know the basics of vim and then learn further from within that environment. If you’re already an intermediate to advanced user, then the keybindings between VSCode and Vim tend to interfere with each other. You’ll have to relearn how to do it.
Thats why I bind toggling them to a hotkey. One or the other at a time, never both.
vscodium slightly better than vscode tho.
honestly all ide’s are rubbish - especially electron ones. for a gui editor, i’ve just gone back to sublime text and have never been happier.
Tbf codium is a very well optimized electron app. Don’t believe me? Try discord
very well optimized electron app
It’s like a very light Elephant
Notepad++ is good but a bit bloated. Would not call it rubbish. Node is solid.
Is there a stable way to use closed extensions (like the MS Python one) with vscodium by now? I’d love to get away from MS’ grasp, but it’s much harder if I’ll be missing out on language integrations.
Is there a stable way to use closed (edit: intentionally DRM-ed) extensions (like the MS Python one) with vscodium by now?
Yes. Use this config edit.. Everything (edit: not written by assholes) works fine.
Edit: Damn. PyLance’s developers are up to some bullshit. I would take a hard look at who I’m accepting free candy from, if I used it.
Hm, people in the GitHub issue are still complaining that it doesn’t work. Does it work fine for you?
I’ve never had any issues with any VSCode plugin failing in VSCodium.
But I’m not a PyLance user.
Your experience with other extensions sadly doesn’t mean much for Pylance. It specifically has DRM implemented to prevent vscodium from loading it, just like some other MS extensions. That’s why I’m asking.
The big one (imo) is extensions. Outside of the vscode/atom/vim/emacs ecosystems sublime has probably the largest library of extensions, and they’re readily installable. So if you want an extensible text editor that’s not based around electron or the terminal it’s the obvious answer.
Atom? People still use atom?
Atom is dead, the successor is called Pulsar
Technically the successor is called VSCode and the original authors are working on Zed.
vscode is an entirely different editor not based on atom. All it used was the atom shell archive https://github.com/electron/asar and electron
Oh I meant in that Atom was sunsetted to make way for it mostly.
Zed for lightweight, Kate for regular text and the Jetbrains suite for when I want something that uses all of my RAM, but has a lot of niceties.
The only time I open up vscodium is when I want to conveniently edit files in a docker container that are part of the image rather than mapped from my filesystem
What is your opinion on Lapce ?
What is your opinion on Lapce ?
